Torture?

It's hard to find it anything other than unutterably depressing that we're having a serious national debate on whether we should torture people. Yes, yes, I know that many of them are terrorists--but c'mon. Torture?

Can any conservatives defend this? The Bush administration--perfectly willing to let the Republican congress spend us into oblivion without the faintest hint of a veto--is suddenly threatening to shoot down a defense appropriations bill in wartime unless a provision forbidding torture is removed?

Have we really slid this far? What comes next, a proposal to overturn the thirteenth amendment? (Yes, that's ludicrous--but is it that much more ludicrous than the fact that the administration is demanding the right to torture suspects?)